Phoebe Greenwood’s polemical caricature of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict


1612We’ve recently commended Harriet Sherwood for her modest improvements in covering the region, and in taking the first tentative steps towards giving voice to the legitimate concerns of Israelis as well as Palestinians. Specifically, we noted that Sherwood, the Guardian’s Jerusalem correspondent, recently began seeking comment from mainstream Israelis, rather than simply those representing the far-left, thus enabling her readers to better understand the political dynamics at play in the Israeli -Palestinian Conflict.

Unfortunately, we can’t say the same for Phoebe Greenwood, who has filled in for Sherwood for over a month while she was away.  Greenwood, as with so many ‘journavists’, seems to see her role, in a manner consistent with the au courant post-colonial politics of her day, as providing a voice to the powerless – a binary paradigm which, in ignoring the broader Israeli-Arab and Israeli-Islamist regional conflict, necessarily tailors her reports in a manner which show Palestinians in the best possible light.  Israelis, when they enter the picture at all, are often crude caricatures – a recognizable Goliath in each chapter of the tale she conjures.

Greenwood’s latest report, ‘Palestinian buy land to protect future state and generations‘, March 18, is ostensibly a story about Palestinians purchasing land in the West Bank to secure their presence in the region.  However, such land acquisition is framed as merely a part in a larger Israeli-Palestinian struggle for territory, which she believes defines the conflict – a battle for over 5,000 sq kilometers of real estate in Judea and Samaria which, she claims, Israel is winning.

Israel, according to Greenwood, is winning the war for land by unfairly building “illegal” settlements.  In an effort to explain Israeli motivations for such ‘land grabs’, she adds the following:

Many Israeli Jews believe they have a God-given right to settle anywhere in the biblical land of Israel. Others justify the defiance of international law on the grounds of national security or argue that Arabs cannot be trusted.

This, evidently, represents Greenwood’s conception of Israeli Jews: Violators of international law motivated by religious fundamentalism and racism.

Whilst it’s nice that Greenwood also mentioned Israeli national security concerns, her lazy generalization fails to even address the fact that many Israelis (and many legal scholars) don’t believe that living in Judea and Samaria is ‘illegal’, as their political justification for their presence is supported by Jewish history and, more importantly, codified legally by the Mandate for Palestine – an international adjudication which has never been abrogated.

However, more toxic than Greenwood’s imputation of outlaw status to Israelis who live in communities on the other side of the 1949 armistice lines is the casual accusation of racism – representing a staggering moral inversion given Arab belligerence throughout Israel’s nearly 65 years of existence.

Though the breezy dismissal of Israeli concerns that a deal with the Palestinians, which potentially would remove hundreds of thousands of Jews from their homes, may not in fact deliver peace, represents somewhat of the norm amongst even those in the media who claim to empathize with Zionism, the suggestion that such fears are inspired by anti-Arab racism is at best intellectually lazy, and arguably an indication of a broader malevolence.

Israeli Jews who are skeptical of Palestinian peace overtures are rationally responding to several different, though related, historical and political realities.

First, Israeli caution over the possibilities for peace are based, in part, on an understanding of most of the Arab world’s continuing refusal to accept, or in any way normalize relations with, the Jewish state within any borders – a concern only heightened by the ascendancy of Islamism since the start of the ‘Arab Spring’.

Second, Israelis have learned important lessons from the failures of Oslo, and, especially, their withdrawals from South Lebanon and Gaza – the latter representing a perfect cautionary tale regarding the danger of assuming the validity of the ‘land for peace’ formula , or even that Israeli presence in “occupied” land represents the main cause of Arab hostility.

Finally, to address Greenwood’s specific accusation, Israeli concerns over the sincerity of Arab leaders’ putative calls for peace are motivated, in part, by a sober understanding of the pervasive antisemitism among the overwhelming majority of citizens in the Arab world.  Israelis are aware of the state-sponsored hate spewing from Ramallah, Gaza City, Cairo, and Damascus, and understand intuitively that true peace can only be achieved when their neighbors begin to embrace truly liberal values – not merely in rejecting antisemitism, but by adopting democratic norms, treating women, gays and religious minorities with respect, and beginning to nurture a culture of self-criticism.

The path to peace in the region will be a long and arduous one, but must begin with a West, and Western media, that is just as demanding of the Arab world as they are of the Jewish state.  Such moral consistency would of course require the rejection of old, tired and destructive ideologies which place groups, a priori, in arbitrary categories of victim and oppressor – expecting little from the former and everything from the latter.

Until such a moral and journalistic revolution within the mainstream media occurs, however, we can expect stringers like Phoebe Greenwood to continue failing to hold a mirror to a sclerotic Arab political culture which represents a nearly impenetrable barrier to peace and progress in the Middle East.

92 comments on “Phoebe Greenwood’s polemical caricature of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict

  1. Which cloud cuckoo land does the blogger live in? Israel is the one that has special relationship with EU. It is the one that gets Military aid from the West. Israel is the one that is allowed it Nuclear arsenal. Iraq was invaded even, as we now know, on the basis of rigged up evidence to suggest that it had WMD’s. Iran has sanctions against it. Leaders of all the three main political Parties in Britain defend Israel’s right to defend itself. None of them defend the rights of the Palestinians even to their own homes. Get real.

    • Ashley – please explain why any of this is in any way relevant to Phoebe Greenwood’s view of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict? I am particularly interested to hear why the invasion of Iraq and sanctions against Iran are linked.

      I would draw my own conclusions, but I would hate to be accused of “putting words into your mouth”.

    • “Which cloud cuckoo land does the blogger live in?”

      ashley, that’s essentially what I’ve been thinking about you.

  2. ashley george Britain gave out the White Paper in 1939 barring all Jewish immigration to the land, while allowing thousands of Arabs in.
    Britain did this to appease the Arabs.
    Britain gave 75& of the Mandate borders to the Arabs in 1922 and named the country after the Jordan River. (Jordan)

  3. Phoebe Greenwood needs to stop turning a blind eye to the Palestinians racist murderous media against Jews.

    http://www.palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=157&doc_id=8636
    UK Parliament debates hate incitement and UK funding of PA, based on PMW findings
    Itamar Marcus and Nan Jacques Zilberdik
    Mar. 17, 2013

    UK Parliament scrutinizes Palestinian hate incitement, terror glorification and British funding of PA in debate examining PMW findings

    MP Ellman: “The matters… are truly shocking and put a question mark over the status of the Palestinian Authority as a partner for peace”

    MP Henderson: “No peace agreement will be able to guarantee…peace if a generation of Palestinians is growing up indoctrinated to hate Israel, Jews and the West

  4. Liberal values give us a break – start by abiding to international law. Respect of Human Rights, rights of minorities, rights of refugees. As Gandhi said when asked what he thought of Western Civilization he said it would be a good idea. Perhaps begin by ending ethnic cleansing. End of administrative detention particularly of children.

    • You are quite right, Ashley. It is time the PA and Hamas started adhering to international law, respecting human rights, the rights of minorities, the rights of refugees (to be settled and given a decent life as all other refugees have), and ending the ethnic cleansing of anyone that is the wrong religion, sexuality, or even type of Muslim. Also ending the unjustified detention of political opponents, journalists etc. Also, while we’re here, you forgot to mention ending the indoctrination of children to hate “the other” and to seek martyrdom.

      Glad you agree that these are necessary before tolerant, diverse, generous Israel can take them seriously as partners for peace.

  5. Britain also barred Asians from East Africa coming to Britain. That did not give the Asian countries the right to invade Britain. Palestinians constituted overwhelming majority in the whole of Palestine. How come they are minority now? Where they ethnically cleansed?
    On the one hand Israel insists to control whoever enters what it perceives to be its borders. On the other hand it complains that Zionists were kept out of Palestine. Cannot have it both ways. Besides Palestinians want their country back. The world recognizes the right of return of all refugees. It will happen. Get used to it.

    • Typical of the trendy new-antisemitism is this blindly partisan statement ‘Palestinians want their country back’. Israelis don’t have the right to self-determination guaranteed by the real provisions of international law apparently: they represent the eternal wandering Jew once again, whom the bigots & prejudiced wish to send on his journey.

      According to ashley george Israelis are seen too to have to admit declared enemies who are ludicrously called ‘refugees’ despite the fact that they are Palestinian living in Palestine. This too despite the protective provision that only legislates for real refugees who wish to live ‘at peace’.

    • Hello Ashley.

      “The worl recognises the right of return of all refugees.” Wrong.
      “It will happen.” Wrong.

      Repatriation is only one of THREE “durable solutions” for refugees supported by the UN and even the UN recognise that it “requires the full commitment of the country of origin to help reintegrate its own people.”. The others are resettlement and integration (http://www.unhcr.org/pages/49c3646cf8.html).

      The Palestinians, uniquely, have refused to consider (or been refused by their Arab “brethren”) the possibility of integration or resettlement. Even those who are integrated and made welcome in other countries (such as Britain and the US) still uniquely identify themselves and their descendants as “refugees”.

    • “The world recognizes the right of return of all refugees.” boy george

      You don’t speak for “the world”. “The world” is not a person, so it cannot recognize anything.

      “It will happen. Get used to it.”

      It will not, sorry. Wake up from your lunatic judeophobic dream.

    • ashley,
      It’s hard to keep responding to you, because a) you’re so ignorant and b) you don’t listen. All those things you complain about have already been explained to you.

    • “Palestinians constituted overwhelming majority in the whole of Palestine.”

      Defined as what? When you say “the whole of Palestine” I take it that you mean the artificial borders drawn within the Arab homeland against the wishes of the local Grand Mufti and company by the hated western imperialists separating it from “greater Syria.” When you say “the Palestinians” I take it you mean certain groups of Arabs and only Arabs living in (and migrating into) the area within those imperialist drawn artificial boundaries. Did I get that right, troll?
      “On the one hand Israel insists to control whoever enters what it perceives to be its borders.”
      So does Britain. And Mahmoud Abbas is now insisting on the same right. It’s catching on !
      “On the other hand it complains that Zionists were kept out of Palestine.”
      Imagine that! A right guaranteed to them under international law, abrogated by the British imperialists, and those uppity Jews had the audacity to complain!
      “Cannot have it both ways.”
      Wrong again, obviously.
      “Besides Palestinians want their country back.”
      Since no such people or country had ever existed, to whom would you give “it” back, and what exactly would you give them?

  6. ashley george, you must be talking about the minorities in the Arab world who are all persecuted. I’m talking about the Kurds, Coptics, Black Christians of Sudan, Berbers, Western Saharan’s, Chaldeans and the Jews. Oh Wait, their are no Jews in the Arab world.They were all kicked out.

    If you care about Arab children, you would protest Palestinian leaders using children as human shields and human fodder.
    http://palestinianchildabuse.com/

  7. Isn’t it time Ashley George condemn Palestinian leaders for their child abuse?

    http://palestinianchildabuse.com/
    Palestinian society abuses its children
    Posted by Palestinian Child Abuse on September 6, 2012

    Palestinian society abuses its children, teaching them to hate and kill themselves to kill others
    Under self-rule on the West Bank and Gaza, child sacrifice has turned into a normative part of the socialization process as the phenomenon of suicide bombers has escalated to epidemic proportions.6

    From an early age, children are fed anti-Zionist, anti-Jewish and anti-Western hate propaganda. Mosques, schools, summer camps, and even children’s television programs are exploited to encourage children to become martyrs in an act that will bring them respect and parental pride:

    In Hamas-run kindergartens, signs on the walls read: “The children of the kindergarten are the shahids (holy martyrs) of tomorrow.”7
    A television show called “The Children’s Club” shows a young Palestinian, age 9 or 10 proclaiming, “When I wander into Jerusalem, I will become a suicide bomber.”8
    The Palestinian Authority-controlled television,9 broadcasts MTV-style videos for teens that glorify suicide bombing and martyrdom.
    A 6th grade Palestinian textbook, Our Beautiful Language, includes the “Shahid Song” that encourages death in war as a shahid or martyr. Other textbooks carry similar messages.
    At a Palestine Authority summer camp in 2002, 25,000 children were trained in how to make firebombs, use firearms, and ambush and kidnap targeted enemies.10
    An Islamic Jihad summer school massages the libidos of teenage boys by telling them they will “liberate Palestine from the Jews” by becoming martyrs, and promise the boys that they will be greeted by 72 virgins.11
    Kindergartens, schools, summer camps, and school sports tournaments (and other institutions) are named after terrorists and young suicide bombers, who are used as pedagogic role models.12
    One of the most chilling examples of Palestinian role modeling occurred in the case of Aziz Salha, age 20, a participant in the lynching of two Israelis at the Ramallah police station in October 2000.13 The London Telegraph reported how Salha “choked one of the soldiers while others beat him. When he saw that his hands were covered in blood, he went to the window and showed them to the crowd below.” This unforgettable scene, captured by a foreign news crew, is used as the focus for adoration and reenactment14 in Gaza kindergartens, much as children in American public school might reenact the signing of the Declaration of Independence.

    Throughout the Palestinian territories, walls are plastered with posters of young martyrs who are idolized by Palestinian youth the way other teens worship rock stars.

    Against such a backdrop, Wajdi Hatab, age 14, told his classmates days before being killed: “When I become a martyr, give out kannafa (traditional cake).”15

    B’tselem, an Israeli human rights organization that monitors Israeli conduct toward Arabs in the West Bank and Gaza, sharply rebuked Palestinian leadership for making little effort to keep children away from potentially violent confrontations.16

    Bassam Zakhour, a bereaved Palestinian father, was far more frank. He blamed Palestinian Authority television for enticing his 14 year-old son to run off with two other schoolmates ‘to kill Jews.’ The trio was chosen by Hamas handlers because their ‘innocent’ looks would not arouse suspicion. They entered a Jewish settlement with knives and explosives packed in their schoolbags.17

    Indeed, the age of children volunteering for suicide missions is dropping from men in their 20s to children in their teens and preteens.

    At the same time, the scope of violence between the first Intifada and the second has escalated. Where Palestinian children threw rocks in the 1980s, they began throwing firebombs in 2000. In more than three years of guerrilla warfare since 2000, Palestinian leaders use children in warfare against Israel in other ways as well.

    Toddlers have served as cover for terrorist activity by hiding munitions in their clothing. Paramedics found an explosive belt with 21 kilograms of explosives hidden under the pad of an ambulance stretcher carrying an ill Palestinian child.18 The Hezbollah weekly journal reported19 that children had helped make weapons and ammunition in the Jenin refugee camp, and then clashed with Israeli forces after they were armed with grenades and explosives. In July 2003, two Palestinian assailants posed as a family, accompanied by a female accomplice with a 4-year-old child (her niece). The accomplice and child were used as bait in the knife-point kidnapping of a Jewish cab driver. Later, another child passed through Israeli checkpoints while carrying supplies to the kidnappers.20

    In addition to growing more lethal, terrorist acts are also gradually involving more Palestinian teenagers, including girls.21 Some examples of these alarming trends:22

    February 16, 2002. An 18-year-old boy blew himself up outside a pizzeria in the territories, killing three Israelis and wounding 30.
    March 30, 2002. A 16-year-old girl walked into a Jerusalem supermarket and detonated a bomb concealed under her clothing, killing two Israelis and wounding 22 others.
    April 23, 2002. Three teenagers from Gaza, armed with knives and explosives, were killed attempting to crawl under a perimeter fence to attack residents of a Jewish settlement.
    May 2002. A 16-year-old boy with a suicide belt strapped to his body, was arrested in a taxi near Jenin
    June 13, 2002. A 15-year old girl was arrested for throwing a firebomb at IDF soldiers. She admitted she was a recruit.
    July 30, 2002. A 17-year-old boy from Beit Jala, an Arab suburb of Jerusalem, became disoriented after being dropped off by his adult handler, blew himself up outside a virtually empty falafel stand in the city and injured five Israelis.
    The milieu that encourages hatred and revenge and glorifies death draws more and more children into violence. On January 11, 2003, two children, ages 8 and 14, who had armed themselves with knives, were apprehended in an Israeli settlement after trying to stab a Jewish passerby.23 Are these isolated incidents? A survey of 1,000 Palestinian children between the ages of 9 and 16, conducted by the Islamic University in Gaza, found that 73 percent of the children surveyed wanted to be martyrs.24

    Countless Palestinian parents support, encourage and praise the sacrifice of their children in suicide bombings and other terrorist attacks.

    Arab culture holds these child-soldiers in such high regard that parents accept the deaths of their children with pride. A June 2002 public opinion survey conducted by the independent Arab-polling institute Jerusalem Media and Communications Center, found 68 percent of Palestinian adults support suicide bombing operations.25 The father of a 13- year-old says, “I pray that God will choose him [to be a martyr].” The father of another youth who carried out a June 2002 attack outside a Tel Aviv disco declares: “I am very happy and proud of what my son did, and frankly, I’m a bit jealous.”26 Financial incentives to families of suicide bombers also provide parents with reason to acquiesce, especially given the poverty of a majority of Arabs in the West Bank and Gaza, where living standards have plummeted since September 2000.

    The Palestinian Authority pays parents $2,000 for each child killed and $300 for each wounded child.
    Saudi Arabia pledged $250 million as part of a billion-dollar fund established to aid families whose children are killed.
    The Arab Liberation Front, a group loyal to former Iraqi President Saddam Hussein, was paying $10,000 to the parents of each child killed and $25,000 for suicide bombers.27
    Moral support also comes from other Arab nations. The Saudi ambassador to Great Britain wrote an ode to a 17-year-old female suicide bomber. One of the most frightful messages among those who justify young suicides came from Dr. Adel Sadeq, chairman of the Arab Psychiatrists Association and head of the department of psychiatry at Ein Shams University in Cairo. He wrote an open letter to President George W. Bush entitled, “Class Isn’t Over Yet, Stupid” that declared:28

    “Don’t you understand, stupid, that when a girl of 18 springs blows herself up, this means that her cause is right, and that her people will be victorious sooner or later?”

    In an interview on Egyptian satellite TV Iqraa, Dr. Sadeq further clarified:

    “Our culture is one of sacrifice, loyalty and honor. … Bush was mistaken when he said that the girl was killing the future when she chose to kill herself. On the contrary: She died so that others would live. … When the martyr dies a martyr’s death, he attains the height of bliss…. The message to Israel is that we will not cease. … It is very important to convey this message. … The child who threw a stone in 1993 today wraps himself in an explosive belt. … Either we will exist or we will not exist. Either the Israelis or the Palestinians – there is no third option.”29

    Some parents and social organizations do protest the barbaric use of children as warriors, although not necessarily criticizing suicide bombing as a tactic. Unfortunately, they are small voices in the wilderness.

    Some Arab parents have condemned the use of children as combatants, but their voices are isolated and they carry the risk of being ostracized and vilified. In December 2000, a local group of Palestinian women trade unionists called on the Palestinian Authority to stop using children as cannon fodder: “We don’t want to send our sons to the front line, but they are being taken by the Palestinian Authority,” said a mother of six from the West Bank city of Tulkarem.30 A nurse from Gaza who spoke out on television was condemned in the Arabic media as a traitor. Others reveal that they have been threatened by armed Fatah officials for discouraging their children from participating in clashes.31

    While Palestinian leaders exhort the public into volunteering their children for suicide missions, they make sure their own children are not among the volunteers.

    Many Palestinian leaders who tell parents that it is their patriotic duty to sacrifice their children32 have sent their own offspring abroad (as have other Palestinians with the financial means), while others keep their own children under close supervision to ensure their safety.

    Past’s PA Chairman Yasser Arafat, for instance, sent his wife and young daughter to Paris, where they reportedly lived on a generous monthly PA allowance of $100,000, The Palestinians’ First Lady Suha endorsed suicide operations: “There would have been no greater honor” than watching her son take his own life for the Palestinian struggle for independence – if only she had a son, the Sorbonne graduate told a London-based Arabic paper.33

    In October 2000, a London-based Lebanese columnist, Hodo Husseini, condemned Palestinian leadership in the pan-Arab daily Al Sharq al-Awsat by asking: “What kind of enlightened independence will rise on the blood of the children, while the leaders [and] their [own] children and grandchildren are sheltered?” She and other critics were branded as “too Westernized to understand” in an editorial published in the PA’s state-controlled daily Al Hayat al-Jadida.

    One of the most poignant protests against turning children into warriors came from Abu Saber, a bereaved father. He wrote to the London Arabic daily Al-Hayat about his eldest son who had been convinced to become a shahid, and how he learned that his dead son’s friends “were starting to wrap themselves like snakes around my other son, not yet 17, to direct him down the same path … to avenge his brother’s death.” He asked in anguish:34

    “By what right do these leaders send the young people, even young boys in the flower of their youth, to their deaths? Who gave them religious or any other legitimacy to tempt our children and urge them to their deaths?… Why until this very moment haven’t we seen one of the sons or daughters of any of these people don an explosive belt and go out to carry out in deed, not in words, what their fathers preach day and night?”

    In his letter, Abu Saber cited by name sheikhs and leaders who had sent their sons abroad “the moment the Intifada broke out” – including the son of the past head of Hamas in Gaza – the late Dr. Abdul Al-Rantisi,35 whose wife, he charged, “has refrained from sending her son Muhammad to blow himself up. Instead, she sent him to Iraq, to complete his studies there.”

    • Why are you posting a link to a pornographic Kahanist website that targets Jews and to an article that sites well known fraud Joan Peters for evidence?

      Why did 6 other readers give this 5 stars? I think this website might be attracting some very unsavoury types.

        • Because I suspect that this website is not run by fascists and they might take note of the poisonous atmosphere that they have (unwittingly?) cultivated here if I point it out.

          I would suggest that remarks like this Meridian character’s are deleted and that steps are taken to alienate such thugs and fanatics above the line.

          Quick question – do you have no complaints about someone linking to the Masada2000 hate site?

    • “Why isn’t Phoebe Greenwood writing about the Kurds?”
      No one cares because there are no Jews to blame.

      I think Tibetans are the ones who really deserve a state. They harm no one but themselves.

  8. I did. I saw a picture of Palestinian child standing between two Israeli soldiers with his hands tied with cable ties. It was a ridiculous spectacle of abuse of children. Also, this week we mark 10th anniversary of Rachel Corrie who lost her life trying to stop a demolition of a Palestinian house.

    Some more history The first recorded incident of Israel Defense Forces killing Palestinian children was in November 1950 when three Palestinian children from the village of Yalo aged 8, 10 and 12, were shot near Dayr Ayyub in the Latrun salient. According to adult witnesses, “only one man fired at them with a sten-gun but none of the detachment attempted to interfere.”[79] In February 1953, one of five Arab shepherds shot in al-Burj was 13 years old.[80] During the 1952 Beit Jala raid, 4 children ranging in age from 6 to 14 were killed by machine gun fire.[81]

    • Oh dear, Ashley. Behind the times, aren’t we? Rachel Corrie lost her life trying to stop a bulldozer clearing waste ground of cover used by bombers and snipers. Doesn’t sound quite so noble now, does it?

  9. I did. Recently, I saw a picture of Palestinian child standing between two Israeli soldiers with his hands tied with cable ties. It was a ridiculous spectacle of abuse of children. Also, this week we mark 10th anniversary of Rachel Corrie who lost her life trying to stop a demolition of a Palestinian house.

    Some more history The first recorded incident of Israel Defense Forces killing Palestinian children was in November 1950 when three Palestinian children from the village of Yalo aged 8, 10 and 12, were shot near Dayr Ayyub in the Latrun salient. According to adult witnesses, “only one man fired at them with a sten-gun but none of the detachment attempted to interfere.”[79] In February 1953, one of five Arab shepherds shot in al-Burj was 13 years old.[80] During the 1952 Beit Jala raid, 4 children ranging in age from 6 to 14 were killed by machine gun fire.[81]

    • Ok you want history?
      February 1951 – Jamil Muhammad Mujarrab, a member of a Jordanian armed group, raped and murdered an Israeli girl in Jerusalem’s Katamon neighborhood
      Jan 1, 1952 – Seven gunmen attacked and killed a nineteen year-old girl in her home, in the neighborhood of Beit Yisrael, in Jerusalem.

      June 11, 1953 – Gunmen attacked a young couple in their home in Kfar Hess, and shot them to death.

      October 12, 1953 – Yehud attack – A Palestinian Fedayeen squad threw a grenade into a civilian house in Yehud, killing a woman and two of children.

      April 11, 1955 – Shafir shooting attack – Two Palestinian militants whom infiltrated to Israel from Jordan opened fire on a synagogue full of children and teenagers, in the farming community of Shafir, killing three children and a youth worker and injuring five, three of them seriously.

      Shall I go on

      I saw a picure of a 3 year old child criticly wounded by a stone thrown by your peaceful plaestian youth.

  10. How come Golda Meir who denied the existence of the Palestinian People, who was quite happy to satisfy her conscience that Palestinians do not exist and that Palestine was a land without people has all of a sudden in her death become the patron for the rights of the Palestinian children. Do try and keep up. Nobody will buy sheer propaganda in today’s internet savvy world. It is incompetent bloggers like you who are making it difficult for Israel hide its crimes.

    • Well she is dead isn’t she if it’s ture nobody asked her permission.. Many people said Palestinian do not exist and all of them arabs.
      “There is no such country as Palestine. ‘Palestine’ is a term the Zionists invented. There is no Palestine in the Bible. Our country was for centuries part of Syria. ‘Palestine’ is alien to us. It is the Zionists who introduced it”.

      - Auni Bey Abdul-Hadi, Syrian Arab leader to British Peel Commission, 1937 -

      “There is no such thing as Palestine in history, absolutely not”.

      - Professor Philip Hitti, Arab historian, 1946 -

      “It is common knowledge that Palestine is nothing but Southern Syria”.

      - Representant of Saudi Arabia at the United Nations, 1956 -

    • ashley,
      As I said before, you are so filled with ignorance, half-truths (essentially lies), and lies, that it’s hard to speak to you. It’s already been explained to you that the Arabs who’ve now taken up the exclusive (and exclusionary) identity of “the Palestinian people have no real linguistic, cultural, religious connection to the Philistines in history. To say the Palestinians are a national grouping whose identity goes back to ancient times is a ruse. It’s already been explained to you that what you like to call “Historic Palestine” was a territorial unit created by the British as part of the League of Nations Mandate for Palestine, and initiated to reconstitute the historical homeland of the Jews for the Jews. Real historical maps have always included areas east of the Jordan river as part of the territory generically referred to as Palestine, never much, if any of the Negev Desert. Yet, the only territories ever claimed by the Palestinians as part of their “long-lost, ancient homeland” have been completely congruent with those areas that are ruled by Jews. Before 1967, the Palestinians claimed with specificity that the West Bank and Gaza were NOT part of Palestine.
      Are you starting to get the picture of what this is really all about? I doubt it.

  11. Barry How come Golda Meir who denied the existence of the Palestinian People, who was quite happy to satisfy her conscience that Palestinians do not exist and that Palestine was a land without people has all of a sudden in her death become the patron for the rights of the Palestinian children. Do try and keep up. Nobody will buy sheer propaganda in today’s internet savvy world. It is incompetent bloggers like you who are making it difficult for Israel hide its crimes.

  12. ashley george, you mean this Rachel Corrie.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122721334185245307.html
    A Tribute to Rachel Corrie
    Thanks for showing us what “peace” really means.
    RUHAMA SHATTAN
    March 16, 2004

    Today is the first anniversary of Rachel Corrie’s death. I want to thank Corrie for the explosives that flow freely from Egypt to Gaza, via the smuggling tunnels under the Gaza homes that she died defending.

    Perhaps it was these explosives that in the year since her martyrdom–oops, death–have been strapped around suicide bombers to blow up city buses and restaurants in Israeli cities, particularly in Jerusalem, killing men, women and schoolchildren (two of them classmates of my daughter and her friend in the February 22, 2004 bombing) and leaving hundreds more widows, orphans and bereaved parents.

    On the first anniversary of her death, I want to thank Rachel Corrie for showing Palestinian children how to despise America as she snarled, burned an American flag, and led them in chanting slogans, and as she gave “evidence” at a Young Palestinian Parliament mock trial finding President Bush guilty of crimes against humanity.

    Perhaps her help in fanning the flames of violent anti-American sentiment led to the October 2003 bombing of the Fulbright delegation to Gaza to interview scholarship candidates, killing three. There will be no new crop of Palestinian Fulbright scholars this fall.

    On the first anniversary of her death, I wanted to thank Rachel Corrie for providing her organization, the Palestinian-sponsored International Solidarity Movement, with the opportunity to release a manipulated photo sequence “showing” an Israeli military bulldozer deliberately crushing her. (I would also like to thank the Associated Press and the Christian Science Monitor for taking up the baton and immortalizing this cynical ISM stunt.)

    On the first anniversary of her death, I want to thank Rachel Corrie for showing the way to all those who seek peace in the Middle East. Unfortunately, Corrie’s peace, as anyone familiar with the Palestine Liberation Organization, Fatah, Hamas and Hezbollah organizations that she defended with her life knows–or as anyone familiar with the weekly rants of the Friday preachers in the Palestinian mosques is aware–means not peaceful coexistence but the elimination of the state of Israel, and death to those they call “the usurping Jews, the sons of apes and pigs.”

    Thank you, Rachel Corrie, of Evergreen State University, where the profs wear khakis and kaffiyehs at graduation ceremonies, for showing us what peace really means.

  13. Barry what can I say apart from the fact that you choose to dance on peoples graves. She was killed by an Israeli bent on bulldozing a Palestinian house. She was full of humanity. An American flag or any flag was nothing to her or me compared to the children whose houses she was helping to save. Obviously a piece of cloth to you is worth killing to Rachel and to me it is not. That is the difference between barbarity and humanity. Friday prayers in some parts of Palestine, including Jerusalem are offered under the glaring eyes of the IDF sometimes through the telescopic guns they carry.

  14. “political justification for their presence is supported by Jewish history and, more importantly, codified legally by the Mandate for Palestine – an international adjudication which has never been abrogated.”

    If applied generally the ‘Jewish history’ argument would mean native Americans laying claim to the USA, aborigines to Australia and multiple conflicting claims to many parts of Europe; it’s simply nonsensical.

    The Mandate justification is more complex, but still invalid. Mandates were set up specifically to prepare indigenous peoples for self-determination. In the case of Palestine this fundamental principle was ignored and the terms of the Mandate largely followed proposals made by the World Zionist Organisation. Palestinians never accepted the terms and they were enforced by Britain as the mandatory/colonialist power. Britain effectively handed South Africa over to the Afrikaners in 1909 with general international acceptance but that didn’t take away the rights of the indigenous (black) people to fight for self-determination any more than did the Mandate take away similar rights from the indigenous (Arab) people.

    • Indigenous Jews of Jerusalem, Safed, Hebron and so on who lived longer there than any of your imagined indigenous have no right of self Determination according to your Interpretation.
      In those times they were called Palestinians, not the Arabs.

      • “Indigenous Jews of Jerusalem, Safed, Hebron and so on who lived longer there than any of your imagined indigenous have no right of self Determination”

        Of course they have a right to participate in government in proportion to their numbers (that’s called democracy). They don’t, however, have a right to ethnically cleanse most of the population, invite millions of their friends from around the world to occupy the vacated land or to aggressively expand their territory, establish ‘settlements’ on stolen land and oppress those who object.

        • As most of your imagined indigenous immigrated after 1900 their right to occupy and steal vacated land after 1918 on Invitation of their fellow Arabs in the former Ottoman provinces is at least debatable.
          And of course they had no right to ethnically cleanse Hebron and Safed and to murder and to oppress opposed people like in the years 1936-1939.

        • “They don’t, however, have a right to ethnically cleanse most of the population”
          Nor did they, “professor.” Although that stunt was attempted on them by your heroes, who are still searching for that magic bullet.

          “Of course they have a right to participate in government in proportion to their numbers (that’s called democracy).”
          And they do! (Unfortunately, their neighbors don’t seem quite able to embrace that democratic idea very easily.) Of course, you’re in no position to decide what rights they do or don’t have, “professor”. Their right to their own homeland was established and enshrined in international law (the real kind). And they haven’t stolen a thing.

    • “And of course they had no right to ethnically cleanse Hebron and Safed and to murder and to oppress opposed people like in the years 1936-1939.”

      The 36-39 Arab Revolt was a desperate attempt by the indigenous population to resist British colonial rule and (more specifically) mass Jewish immigration. It was put down with great brutality. I don’t know where you are from but just imagine how you would react if your country was ruled by colonialists who facilitated the immigration of large numbers of aliens who openly intended to take it over. I think I can guess.

      • Hebron by the way was in 1929 as well as Safed not frogetting the earliar massacare of Safed in 1834. So what were their exuses than?

        • “I didn;t know turks were native of the land. Weren’t they alien as well.”

          Goodness knows what you mean by that. If you are referring to the time of the Ottoman Empire then of course Turks were part of the same entity as Palestine so they weren’t aliens.

          • “If you are referring to the time of the Ottoman Empire then of course Turks were part of the same entity as Palestine so they weren’t aliens.”

            Then at the time of the British Empire, British people were not aliens in a large part of the World?
            Logic and truth are still not your strong points are they sencar.

          • Terrific, sanity! So by that rationale, the British who were there during the mandate period were not aliens, and the Israelis who now live there as part of the Israeli “occupation” are not aliens either. Great. Glad we’re agreed on this.

      • Fake history is part of your ‘knowledge’, but no valid argument.
        The hero of your imagined indigenous in 1936 was
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Izz_ad-Din_al-Qassam
        a oh so desperate Syrian who nowadays is worshipped as Palestinian martyr
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Izz_ad-Din_al-Qassam_Brigades
        A lot of Arabs migrated from Jordan to the other part of the British mandate, and from Syria, as there were no border controls.
        And in the French mandate war was on, a lot fled to later Israel.

  15. Perhaps Alex you will tell us which international lawyers do not agree than we can discuss the pros and cons.

    But here are some who agree with the rights of the Palestinians and who think Palestinian rights are violated – including some Israeli organisations.
    1. UNHRC – {Now you might say it is biased being dominated by the third world countries who just do not like colonizers – you may be right}
    2. Amnesty International {The undercurrent of violence, abuses of fundamental human rights and disregard for international humanitarian law that have marked over 40 years of Israeli military occupation of the West Bank and Gaza Strip become firmly entrenched and relentless.

    Civilians in both Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories have suffered the most from confrontations.

    The Israeli authorities’ blockade of the Gaza Strip is on-going. Much of the dividing wall being constructed in the West Bank is on Palestinian land, meaning it is in breach of international law. Palestinians cannot move freely in the Occupied Territories and those living in Israel and the West Bank live under constant threat of their homes being demolished.

    The Israeli army uses excessive, sometimes lethal, force against protestors in the West Bank and civilians in border areas of the Gaza Strip, often detaining them without charge or trial. Violence against Palestinians in the West Bank is increasing but perpetrators frequently escape justice.}

    3. Btselem {Since 1994, when settler Baruch Goldstein massacred Moslem worshipers in the Tomb of the Patriarchs, the Israeli military has employed a “policy of separation” in Hebron. This is implemented primarily through severe restrictions on Palestinian movement in downtown Hebron, where most Israeli settlement outposts are located. Lately the military has further entrenched this policy by building a fence dividing a central street in half and only allowing Jews to use the paved side of the street while Palestinians must use a rough, unpaved passage.}

    • Gaza blockade is legal according to the UN. Try Palmer comittee.
      by the way who did the Israeli occupied the west bank from?

    • “UNHRC – {Now you might say it is biased being dominated by the third world countries who just do not like colonizers – you may be right}”

      Don’t know if they like colonizers or not (since many of them have been colonizers themselves), but I can tell you that they don’t like women very much (well maybe for sexual purposes, but not in terms of womens’ rights). It seems that they just came out with a new report, and apparently, according to it, there is only one country in the entire world that oppresses women. I’ll bet you can guess which one.
      Oh wait a minute. Are you a woman? If so, I hope your travel plans don’t include Israel. Maybe you should go to Saudi Arabia, Egypt, or even Hamastan, where you’ll feel safe and your rights will be protected as a “as a woman.”

  16. Palestinian homes can at anytime be declared military training zone and taken away B’Tselem asks? and this is what Corrie was defending the attack by one of the most advanced killing machine of our days.
    What if someone were to barge into your home, declare it a military training zone and evict you? That’s the case for some 1000 Palestinians in the South Hebron Hills. The Israeli military called their home “Firing Zone 918″ and has been trying to expel them for years. Their appeal is currently in court.

    • Are you just going to throw this accusation at me without any explanation? Come on Ashley – I deserve the chance to respond. What have I done or said that is similar to what the “Nazis used to say about those in the Warsaw Ghettos”?

      Are you reallllllly suggesting that the Palestinians in the Disputed Territories have ANY similarities to the Jews in the Warsaw Ghetto(s) who were indeed fighting “for their survival and against extermination”?

  17. You really need to hear what the Israeli Human Rights organisation has to say – It is difficult to shut people up nowadays.
    Yihya Abu Rajab told B’Tselem about the difficulties he and his neighbors encountered in the days after the fence was erected:

    “Before the fence was erected I used to transport both raw materials and the shoes I make in a pushcart. After the fence was erected, we were surprised to see that it has no gate and that we have no way to get out to the street. At first, we went around the fence to get to the street, and the Border Police let us to go by without any trouble. But over the past few days the policemen have not been allowing us to go on the paved road. They left us only a narrow lane behind the fence that leads to stone steps. I can’t push the cart through the narrow passage and the steps, and I have to carry the merchandise on my back and get my children to help me. In addition, the Border Police prevent the children from crossing the paved road on their way to and from school. The children used to ride on their bikes in the street and also ride to the grocery shop. Now they have to pick up their bikes and carry both bike and groceries. Once I came on a bicycle, carrying a large container of olive oil and shoe materials, but the policemen wouldn’t let me go on the paved road.”

    • Ashley – I feel very sorry for Yihya. I have no doubt that individual Palestinians have been disadvantaged by the construction of the security fence.

      But – as others have repeatedly asked you to do – please will you acknowledge the reason for the fence in the first place? Nobody wants it there. Israel doesn’t want to spend the money and human resources constructing, maintaining and policing it. It is, however, a necessary and (crucially) highly effective way of stopping some Palestinians entering Israeli towns and cities and blowing themselves up in an attempt to kill as many Israeli civilians as they can.

      To put it blandly, if the price to be paid for civilians being able to catch a bus or eat a meal without the fear of being blown to smithereens is Yihya having to carry his groceries, that is a price worth paying.

      • Labenal,
        Ashley George will never acknowledge the truth of what you’re are saying, I’m afraid.

  18. I acknowledge that the purpose of the fence is to create separation between Palestinians and Palestinians make their life a misery so they will disappear. If Israel does not want the fence why does it build it nobody is forcing it. If it wants to protect Israelis why does it not build a fence within Israel and protect Israelis.

    You are right to build a wall is a price worth paying but than pay it by building it within Israel. and not forcing others to pay. That is not paying that is robbery. It is illegal by any law as you know it but I suppose you cannot accept such arguments as it exposes the racist nature of the wall, the occupation and ethnic cleansing.

    • Why should I engage with you until you back up your allegation that I am “racist filth” and have said “what the Nazis used to say about those in Warsaw Ghettos”?

    • Another question you have studiously ignored. Why are the invasion of Iraq and the sanctions against Iran anything at all to do with I/P?

  19. what is the difference between Palestinians living in ghettos behind the walls and the Jews in the Warsaw Ghettos? The similarities are obvious. Those in Warsaw ghettos were forced to smuggle food. Oh I fully appreciate that the Zionists ensure that Gaza gets enough calories each day. How very kind. The ones in Gaza are forced to do the same. They are being designated as someone the Zionists cannot live with. The Jews in the Warsaw Ghettos were designated someone the Nazis cannot live with. Do you really think victims of racism gives a monkey whether they are discriminated by the Nazis or the Zionists. Do the victims give a damn whether they are in their millions or in their hundreds? They do not. Racism is racism. Ethnic cleansing is ethnic cleansing. Whether you clean 100 of thousands or hundreds of millions. Palestinians under occupation are no different to the Jews in the Warsaw Ghettos they are both victims of racism. If you cannot see the similarity you are blind to racism. No amount of me telling you would help. Are you really saying that the Palestinians are not dying, are not imprisoned. Are their houses not being destroyed. What happened in Gaza 2008/2009 and than in 2012. Are the Palestinians not being put in Ghettos behind the walls? In what way is that different to what happened to the Jews in the Warsaw Ghettos.

    You have a habbit of asking a question when you get an answer you move on to something else because you really do not have an answer except innuendos. Is their way of admitting your guilt?

    • “what is the difference between Palestinians living in ghettos behind the walls and the Jews in the Warsaw Ghettos? The similarities are obvious.”

      No, ashley. The similarities are contrived – for political gain.

  20. As to your question on Iraq and Iran having to do with Israel? Ask Nethanyu he keeps talking about Iran? Threatening to nuke it and all one day. Demanding that the US does the same the next day.

    • “Ask Nethanyu he keeps talking about Iran? Threatening to nuke it and all one day.”

      Question: ashley, Who screwed your head on for you this morning?

  21. Alexa No I did not know Egypt has a border with Gaza or that Gaza has a coast line or even Israel controls the coast line despite the fact it has no
    right to. Did you know that Israel still controlled that border? May be you did not. You do lead a sheltered life.

    Do you know anything about the wall? If so can you tell me what is the purpose of that wall? is it not to create a ghetto like the one in Warsaw? If it is as some claim to protect the Israelis why is not in Israel? Why does it encroach Palestine? These are serious accusations thrown by me but they are backed by judgments at the International courts and by UN resolutions and various Human Rights organisations.

    • the purpose of the wall was to stop terrorist activities ( inc suicide bombing with all the spiritual benefits of martyrdom – houris etc ) so far it has been successful. to all rational and compassionate people, that’s a good thing, isn’t it ?

      • snuffy – of course it is. But don’t expect ashley to agree, because he/she is neither rational nor compassionate.

        • ashley george ha ha ! i thought my name snuffy degauss was a bit weird. i guess it sounds better than muhammed muhammed al muhammed

    • Israel contorl the border between Egypt and Gaza? really? Where do get your information from I wonder.
      Was it Israel who was responsible for flooding the tunnles between Gaza and Egypt?

  22. apart from rachel corrie, there was another peace activist killed – Vittorio Arriigoni. we don’t hear much about his death these days. I wonder why ?

  23. Newsflash: just because a few racist bigots and their cheerleader Alan Dershoshit don’t think that the occupation is illegal, doesn’t change the facts that it is!

    • Oo. Very clever. You changed part of Alan Dershovitz’s name to make it sound rude. That must mean he is ignorant and his opinion is worthless. Thanks for making that clear to me. Of course, if you say he’s wrong, he must be.

      And yes – I am well aware that this is a tactic used by some on this site to belittle those that disagree with them. I find that pathetic and juvenile too.

    • Sanity,
      May I assume that you mean Alan Dershowitz, the same Alan Dershowitz who has been against settlements since 1972?

  24. Labenal You should discuss Alan Dershovitz with Norman Finkelstien. – He will tell you a story or two about him and his integrity.

    • Yes, and I’m sure AD would have a thing or two to say about NF, too. We must be fair and allow both their say, don’t you think?

      • Indeed, and then we see that while one writes a detailed book explaining why one is a plagiarist, the other runs a concerted campaign to prevent the other from getting tenure. But you know, we can continue your make-believe world if you prefer!

    • Great job ashley! You’ve managed to get the spelling of both their names wrong. By the way, you can ask Alan Dershowitz about Finkelstein’s integrity – far more convincing.

Comments are closed.