This is a guest post from Jonathan Hoffman
I wanted to amplify my earlier article about Tony Lerman‘s piece about self-haters.
I was astonished by Lerman’s misrepresentation of Robin Shepherd’s excellent, elegantly written new book, reviewed here recently:
And Robin Shepherd, of the Henry Jackson Society, in a thoroughly wrong-headed book out this month subtitled Europe’s Problem With Israel, uses the concept to explain why leftwing Jews “publicly turn against Israel”.
As Lerman pointed out in the thread (to ‘peterthehungarian’) Shepherd mentions ‘self-haters’ twice (pages 42-43 and 105). But in neither instance does he use the concept to explain why leftwing Jews “publicly turn against Israel”’.
On page 43 he says
Within the Jewish world today the accusation that Jews who publicly turn against Israel are motivated by self-hatred is commonplace. This may be part of the story. But there is another explanation … that could well be more convincing in most cases.
This “other explanation” is that their “radical Left identity” can come to be “of far greater importance than the one that…. they were born into.”
On page 105 he discusses those secular Diaspora Jews whose Jewish identity comes through an affinity with Israel. Anti-Zionist secular Diaspora Jews, Shepherd suggests, are
effectively positing for themselves a state of long-term conversion away from Judaism ….. They may or may not be self-hating Jews but they are certainly self-negating Jews.
He is certainly NOT using the “self-hate” concept “to explain why leftwing Jews “publicly turn against Israel”.
Lerman was completely wrong. He misrepresented Shepherd completely. And so was Matt Seaton wrong, for not agreeing to Shepherd’s request for a correction.
No surprise there whatsoever. They deserve each other.





42 comments
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October 6, 2009 at 3:41 am
The anti discriminator
Wheres everybody gone????..are you guys boycotting CIFwatch as well? Only kidding of course.I have read this a few times and it is sometimes unboycottable .:)
I did avoid it briefly after I noticed your moderators allow terms like “House Jews” …which wouldnt last a second over at your less evil twin !
I note you “monitor and expose anti Semitism” but I can see you miss it here. Im not criticising.. just trying to be helpful ..as you know many try to point out anti Semitism there as well ..not just our pro Zionist brothers and sisters-whose-views-are-important-even-if-we disagree.
You have really shaken up the world of pointing out bias and discrimination on CIF …as long , obviously, as it is one very specific and extremely rare kind of such. I wish you well and kindly let me know if you actually find any yourself!
Take care. Peace to all especially those who could use some.
Tad.
PS for what its worth I liked AKUS and his voice is missing on CIF leaving the real idiots and retreads to produce a ghastly and ill advised defence of the Zionist cause .
October 6, 2009 at 3:51 am
Louise
I think that was a compliment to CiFWatch – in which case thanks.
If any Freedman boycotter has itchy fingers, they are very welcome here.
Great work Jonathan!
October 6, 2009 at 3:52 am
sababa
Much appreciated, Jonathan, that you clarify this issue here; it’s now even more obvious that Lerman misrepresented what Shepherd writes, and it’s therefore even more obvious what it means that Cif wouldn’t allow him to respond to that with a piece of his own.
October 6, 2009 at 3:53 am
Louise
“one very specific and extremely rare kind of such”
It beggars belief how you say that with a straight face after reading all the evidence here …
October 6, 2009 at 5:10 am
The anti discriminator
Louise
.
##It beggars belief how you say that with a straight face after reading all the evidence here …##
Admittedly I havent read it all..just a few scattered bits… I read my profile and stand by every single post ..even funny gentle ones are there. I note nobody has answered my point..why are expressions like “House Jew” a loathsome and disgusting piece of anti Semitism.. allowed?
Anyway you take care. I avoid questions that I cant answer as well so I understand the difficulty.
Tad
October 6, 2009 at 5:35 am
Louise
If you are Berchmans you know very well there are things that are not in our profile of you – remember the Halgeel comment you refused to say was antisemitic?
October 6, 2009 at 6:16 am
The anti discriminator
Louise
Louise
## – remember the Halgeel comment you refused to say was antisemitic? ##
.
Ah yes anti Semitism by omission ..always a handy guide to reality. I am not saying there is never any anti Semitism …but if you have inferred it.. by omission ..from a single post 2 years ago it is hardly serious is it? Since that time we have had a war to talk about ..new allegations of anti Semitism to ridicule…we must move on!
My point is always the same and no one has ever answered it ..if the Catholics were driving the bulldozers would they be a) loved or b) hated?
Tad
October 6, 2009 at 7:04 am
Mita
Berchmans: (why not use your cif name?) My point is always the same and no one has ever answered it ..if the Catholics were driving the bulldozers would they be a) loved or b) hated?
——–
Here’s your answer:
There are deliberately destructive bull-dozers, seeking to kill, maim and eradicate: up-ending buses, squashing taxis, attempting to run people over.
There are also bull-dozers executing legal writs, demolishing the houses of both Arabs and Jews (the latter you don’t know about because your propaganda medium does not publicize them) either because they are built without license (6000 such have been built by Arabs in Jerusalem on public land) or because they belong to people who have committed acts of murderous terror, following the precedents and the laws set by GB during the mandate period.
There are bull-dozers uprooting trees because people are fired at from within their shelter. Yes Rachel Corrie courted her death by one and gained it, blindsiding a poor Druze who lives the rest of his life in consciousness of his deed.
You object to the second type, because it suits your agenda. The first murderous type however you gloss over and justify. “He had a fight with his girlfriend” ” He had an ingrown toenail or he had been fired and hated all Jews”
So, any time you want to ask about bulldozers just think about who drives them, what they do with them and what the reasons are and you can stop asking the question.
I never bothered to say this on CiF because it would have been deleted anyway.
October 6, 2009 at 7:21 am
Louise
Berchmans
Remember you do not have sychophantic moderators minding your back here ….. and you can’t cosy up to them and get Mita’s posts deleted … or anyone else’s come to that
October 6, 2009 at 8:13 am
AKUS
Berchmans – thanks for your comment – I have immediately fired off an e-mail asking to be “unbanned” citing your request.
Louise – let’s have berchmans and all the rest here so that we can actually have a free and open debate.
October 6, 2009 at 9:16 am
The anti discriminator
Mita
.
## There are bull-dozers uprooting trees ##
.
Let us jointly demand this stops..no to any violence regardless of origin and no to the destruction of thousand year old symbols of communities.
Louise
## (no) moderators minding your back here ….. and you can’t cosy up to them and get Mita’s posts deleted …##
.
I tried not to have posts deleted so as to outline the posts which I heartily disagreed with. I huffed and puffed but it was an act . I even laughed on several occasions but would never confess it.
.
AKUS
I will support your reinstatement but would go further ..we have lost many good people ..there was an American Ivanivanivanovitch who although odd and compulsive was funny..really funny..another called Speedy Gonzales who was unconsciously hysterical..as well as the priceless Khartoumi and Tehran Kid …muslims in the thick of the action now lost to CIF.
I would ask for a general amnesty …CIF is 3 and a bit years old we have shouted and screamed and you know I would have been banned if I hadnt been such a crawler.
There are no real horror stories on your side even though I pretend there are. This will stop. Peace to all. Best wishes.
B
October 6, 2009 at 9:38 am
Irish
Anti Discriminator
i will support your support .
L
October 6, 2009 at 10:21 am
peterthehungarian
I support the reinstatement of vicious, violent and hysterical haters like Khartoumi and TeheranKid because they show the real face of CIF. They are the living proof of the alliance and between Bolshevik fossils like Berchmans, Milne etc and the Islamofascists of Iran, Hezb’allah and Hamas.
October 6, 2009 at 11:49 am
Mita
Berchmans you might be a joker but not a very amusing one:
I say “There are bull-dozers uprooting trees because people are fired at from within their shelter”
You ignore the message I send and single out for your protest
## There are bull-dozers uprooting trees ##
talking about violence of any origin and singling out thousand year old symbols of communities by which I presume you mean the trees.
What kind of gibberish is that? How about objecting to the targeting of human beings from amongst the trees instead?
October 6, 2009 at 12:06 pm
Mita
Berchmans
”I think Seth is not just an excellent writer but a fearless campaigner…when we see who is out there .”
As you said you are really smarmy. Who is out where, what should Seth fear? He knows even if you don’t that you can say anything in Israel and be safe. There are no fatwas. Arab MKs call openly for the end of the state in the knesset and there is no reaction beyond indignation. Gideon Levy writes much stronger and much more objectionable stuff for Haaretz and gets invited onto television and he is terrified not of the Jews whom he insults daily but of the Arabs for whom he shills.
October 6, 2009 at 12:25 pm
Mita
Looking at the threads I see somebody concerned that
“TOD
Access to the Temple Mount has been restricted , by Israel, to Muslim worshippers over the age of 50 – on temporary basis.
Obviously there is tension there and the authorities fear violence. Time for all to step back a bit and refuse to escalate the situation. I can see however that these restrictions will anger people and in a situation where rumour and suspicion are rife it is inevitable that darker motives will be attributed to such a move.
Leni”
This commenter doesn’t read the Israeli newspapers and has not noticed that there are wheelbarrows of rocks and boulders standing there in that oh so holy place ready to be thrown on the heads of Jews standing below, praying at the wall. The Israeli authorities have much experience with these crowds and don’t do things lightly. There is much ignorance among those who have never lived in Israel and make assumptions about the situation based on the picture given them by the media.
Darker motives? definitely. The Moslems want to cause trouble and injuries and death if possible.
October 6, 2009 at 12:52 pm
JerusalemMite
Irish – ‘i will support your support .’
I don’t really know about you.
Don’t you realise that ‘The anti discriminator’ is Berchmans posing as a liberal instead of, as Peter put it so well, a fossilized Bolshevik.
October 6, 2009 at 1:04 pm
Demeter
Has Berchmans had makeover in order to grace us with his presence?
If so, may I suggest that we don’t feed the Berchman’s troll although he seems not to realise that he is giving our humble blog the seal of approval by sharing his idiocies here.
And as for an amnesty, (does this idiot mean a hudna and all that implies)? Definitely not! Israel has been fooled by hudnas before, which exist only until their neighbouring Arab barbarians feel strong enough to kill her citizens again.
Georgina Henry could, of course, do what her poor Palestinian charity cases should have done (and she should have encouraged them to do by not colluding with their heightened sense of grievance or professional victimhood by commissioning articles from their murderous leaders) Henry could sue for a permanent peace and make a formal written apology online to all the Jews, Israelis and other decent individuals her blog has insulted over the years by her morbid fascination with Israel and its Jews, and by which she has opened the door to Jew-hatred, and for the travesty of freedom of expression she deludedly peddles.
But I shan’t hold my breath.
And don’t write back to me Berchmans.
October 6, 2009 at 1:11 pm
SilverTrees
Demeter, I agree with you about not feeding the Berchmans troll, and I apologise for feeding him even by referring to him, but just this once:
Is he actually implying that he will support AKUS’ reinstatement on CiF if CiFWatch supports this imbecilic hudna? Why in the name of heaven should AKUS want to return there? Georgina Henry is really scraping the bottom of the barrel if she’s sent Berch to negotiate for her. Anyone who believes that Seth Freedman (Seth Freedman!!!) is an “excellent writer” has to be several sandwiches short of the proverbial picnic.
But then so many Israel/Jew haters on CiF are
October 6, 2009 at 1:28 pm
SilverTrees
AKUS, it wouldn’t be fair. Poor ickle Berchmans is not used to truly free and open debate (which would mean people disagreeing with his views and his not being able to whinge to any moderators to get their posts deleted).
But it would teach him a lesson he wouldn’t be able to ignore, wouldn’t it?
(Or, on second thoughts, perhaps not. I doubt that he is capable of the insight required to learn it).
October 6, 2009 at 4:00 pm
SilverTrees
Louise there’s also Berchmans’ reply to Mitnaged that he can’t blame Palestinians for hating Jews “now” – which sounds rather like something the misanthropic (as far as Israel is concerned anyway) Lerman believes when he blames Israel for the increase in antisemitism worldwide.
I wonder whether Lerman would be allowed to write an article holding Muslims in general responsible, or Berchie could get away with writing a post on CiF about not blaming people for hating Muslims after 7/7 and 9/11 and the terror attacks on the Chabad House in Mumbai and attacks which target Jews anywhere else.
I’d compare Berch to Ben White but Ben White’s IQ is larger than his shoe size and his ego is much larger
October 6, 2009 at 6:00 pm
LicketySplit
To the clueless jerk who posted earlier asking why “house Jew” is allowed here.
I suspect that it’s allowed because it sums up to a T the activities of Tony Lerman and others who write “as Jews” and whose questionable babblings are lapped up by the editors and posted upon Comment is Free to give spurious legitimacy to its own hatred of Israel which is allowed free reign to blend with the Jew-hatred below the line too.
Ignoramuses like you, sir, probably believe what Lerman says because he is saying it as a Jew (although it’s my guess that you would believe it even if Lerman was not a Jew – because it chimes with your own disgusting prejudices). The Guardian pays Lerman to write such rubbish because he is a Jew and because they think that he will be more believable because he is a Jew. I wish there was some way of excommunicating such traitors.
Lerman is the creature of Comment is Free and bought and paid for by them. Which makes him, and others who write there “as Jews” and are bought and paid for, Comment is Free’s house Jews and therefore the lowest of the low because they literally sell their souls for a few minutes of distinctly questionable “glory.”
Shame on them and on those who support them.
October 6, 2009 at 6:16 pm
Demeter
For heaven’s sake people, PLEASE STOP feeding the Berchmans troll!
Every bit of notice given it (including unfortunately this) feeds it. Without that notice it will soon grow bored and go away.
October 6, 2009 at 9:26 pm
Irish
Mita This poster has noticed.
You know as well as I that there are suspicians surrounding various excavations with accusations that the Muslims are hiding Jewish artefacts with Ej’salemites accusing City of David excavators of digging below their houses.
I was merely pointing out that these stories (true or not) add fuel to the fire and raise tensions. I was simply saying that it is better not to inflame a situation which could lead to further violence.
You jump too quickly to the wrong conclusion.
Leni
October 6, 2009 at 10:21 pm
AKUS
Berchmans – thanks for your support … don’t keep it under your kilt … I think I saw you flashing it on a thread somewhere before you were apprehended by the decency squad .. but if you see me on the dark side you’ll know that your malign influence has had its effect.
The Guardians of CiF may be finding gradually that banning those they disagree with – or who disagree with them and their world view – leaves nothing much more than a wimpy group of nodding heads. Its a bit like those pictures you see of the Chinese Communist party plenary sessions, with everyone enthusiastically clapping the approved speakers, even when they are saying things like “the Chinese were the first to discover that the world is flat”.
To others – don;t worry about Berchman’s trolling – there’s only one troll who under no circumstances should be allowed to leave Eora and appear here. I look for the day in which we will see articles appear on CiF with no comments, because everyone prefers to comment here (unless, of course, I’m reinstated there
[throwing down the gauntlet]). Actually two – the history falsifier papagali can be left out as well.
And finally to fill the website they will have to write about Darfur, Congo, Chechnya, Zimbabwe, Tibet, Burma, Sri Lanka, the Uighars, Honduros, Venezuela, the abject poverty and essentially apartheid policies of Brizil and Argentina, Palestinian torture prisons, Syrian torture prisons, Saudi torture prisons, Gabon, Niger, Liberia, Kenyan slum evictions, evictions of South Africans from the Cape Flats and Alexandria, etc. Then when someone mentions Israel, we’ll be there to accuse them of trying to change the subject – which of course, they will be trying to do. What a good old time we’ll have.
So, in the words of a not so great leader – “bring it on”!! The mission is not yet accomplished!!”" Let’s see Namokel or Arkasha try their luck where they’re not protected by a “delete-carrying” ComMod(e).
October 7, 2009 at 12:22 am
The anti discriminator
Demeter
.
##And don’t write back to me Berchmans.##
.
OK
TAD
PS You really must lighten up.
SilverTrees
.
##Louise there’s also Berchmans’ reply to Mitnaged that he can’t blame Palestinians for hating Jews “now” – ##
Someday someone will be brave enough to say if the Palestinians would hate Catholics if they were firing up the bulldozers ..until then I stand by every single post I have ever written except one ..drunk as a skunk..one out of a thousand..not bad eh?
.
LicketySplit
.
##To the clueless jerk who posted earlier asking why “house Jew” is allowed here.##
.
The point I make is that this is a site supposedly to identify anti Semitism yet Jewish folk are somehow predestined to support Israel?? and those who dont are compared to spineless folk from history. This is typification of the worst kind…the difficulty you guys have is that no one here appears to have studied anti Discrimination wich is why you are blundering about.
I will write an article for you and see if I can help!
C J
PS Good luck and best wishes to all. especially of course AKUS who daily seems bigger.
October 7, 2009 at 3:53 am
peterthehungarian
Berchmans
I used to ignore your posts on CIF because they are without any substance, they show your amazing ignorance – remember using Turkish names for Arab players in your stupid and anti-Semite psychodramas and suggesting that Israeli Arab citizens have no voting rights? Maybe the best example of your total lack of any factual knowledge is your post on Freedman’s thread calling the Jerusalem rioters un-Islamic. You haven’t a clue about Islam, about its history, art, science, religious principles and requirements. To make a long story short you are the worst kind of provocateur evidently supported by the CIF staff. But here I know that my criticism of your extremely stupid bullshit won’t be deleted (try to report them to the site owners – it seems to me they are not like your benevolent Bolshevik protectors on CIF – here comment is really free) so let me say something to you.
When you are trying to protect the anti-Semitism of the Muslims in general and of Hamas in particular saying that “if the tank drivers were Buddhists then they’d be anti-Buddhists” (many of the bulldozer drivers are Druze Arabs BTW – naturally you didn’t know this either) you are saying this:
“I understand that Italians hate Roma people – many pickpockets in Rome are Gypsies”
I empathise with the Aryan Nation – there are many black criminals”
“I understand LaRit’s hate of Jews – her Jewish landlord was a greedy bastard”
An other problem with this diamond of your wisdom is the sad fact that in every Muslim country where medieval and modern anti-Semitism are widespread and government supported – people never in their life have seen or met Israeli soldiers, tanks, bulldozers whatever – even not a Jewish person.
If in your alcohol saturated brain the fact that you don’t hate every Jews only the huge majority who stand up for themshelves and don’t allow you to play the big protector of the oppressed and the weak (naturally it depends who is the oppressor – your Bolshevik and/or Muslim heroes or your enemies) means that you are not an antiSemite then suit yourself.
As a real Bolshevik who naturally familiar with Marxist theory (I wonder that in this subject you are as learned as in Islam or the ME) you certainly know that truth is an objective idea and doesn’t depend on subjective wishes.)
And now go back to CIF to report to your minders.
October 7, 2009 at 4:56 am
JerusalemMite
Well done Peter.
Much of what I wanted to say but every time I tried to on CIF, it was (strangely), deleted.
One wonders why. (snigger)
October 7, 2009 at 6:14 am
amie
What a liberation to come here and be able to read the responses which are throttled off on CIF.
Peterthehungarian, someone on Harry’s Place referred to a particularly good response by you on the CiF Lerman thread, which someone pointed out has since been deleted. Can you reproduce it here for the benefit of those like me who visit CIF rarely unless directed there,with reluctance and who missed your comment.
October 7, 2009 at 6:32 am
peterthehungarian
Amie
The reference is really exagerating calling it a good response. My English vocabulary and grammar is not good enough to confront with Lermans twisted and wey long rants. Anyway it has not been deleted (yet)
peterthehungarian
06 Oct 09, 6:23pm (about 17 hours ago)
Mr. Lerman
Its touching to see Robin Shepherd’s friends defending their hero with such devotion, but hero-worship tends to dull the critical faculties, fatally weaken the ability to reason and cloud the eyes so completely that devotees can no longer even read. Which explains how you (and others) can quote what Robin Shepherd wrote about Jewish self-hatred – after first stating categorically ‘I read this book and there is nowhere a word in it about “self hating Jews” only “Jewish members of the radical Left”‘ – and, quite miraculously, claim not to see that he endorses the validity of the concept. This, of course, is not really surprising because even without heroes, you, and others of your opinion, appear to be singularly incapable of reading and understanding a text. It’s so much easier to invent the words you want to hear and put them in the mouth of the person you wish to vilify than to read and understand what they are actually saying. Why let the truth get in the way of a good screaming fit?
In my posts I wrote about my opinion of the correctness of an assumption. In your answer you are speaking about my understanding skills, about my friends and heroes, about my screaming – to make a long story short you are writing about me. No problem, this is the debating style of every desperate person lacking arguments.
In this vein, you pluck out of the ether the completely unfounded implication that I’m saying Robin’s references to Jewish self-hatred ‘constitute a major focus’ of his book
It would be very helpful if you could quote from my text any word supporting your accusations. I didn’t mention any “major focus” what I said that your assertion:
“…(Robin Shepherd) uses the concept to explain why leftwing Jews “publicly turn against Israel” is incorrect and distorts Robin Shepherd’s opinion.
True I didn’t remember that he wrote down these words (self hating Jews) at all exactly because his major focus was in other direction.
Given what has gone before, it’s perfectly clear from this that his ‘may be’ means ‘probably is’, a conclusion confirmed because it is ‘paralleled’ and ‘overlapped’ by
Mr. Lerman as you certainly realized already that the English language is not my forte but allow me to teach you a bit about your mother tongue. “May be” in English means “possible” and not “probable”.
Now if Robin wishes to plead that he inadvertently erred in referring to Jewish self-hatred at all in his book and accepts that if he genuinely doesnt approve of the notion then he should either never have mentioned it or stated categorically that he rejects it, I am prepared to forgive the mistake.
So if I’m writing about a gray donkey then I mustn’t mention that there are white donkeys too and I have to add a categorical rejection of the idea that this gray creature of God could be white if it wouldnt be gray. Your twists are really fantastic and a bit too long.
The italics are quotes from Lerman’s post attacking my this previous post of mine:
peterthehungarian
06 Oct 09, 9:21am
Mr. Lerman
No confusion I’m afraid. See pp. 42-43 and p. 105.
I’m afraid that you must be confused anyway.
On page 43 Shepherd writes:
Within the Jewish world today the accusation that Jews who publicly turn against Israel are motivated by self-hatred is commonplace. This may be part of the story. But there is another explanation … that could well be more convincing in most cases.
The more convincing explanation is the far left worldview of these people and not their psychology in according to the author.
I quote from page 105:
…effectively positing for themselves a state of long-term conversion away from Judaism ….. They may or may not be self-hating Jews but they are certainly self-negating Jews.
Again a very far cry from your assertion Mr. Lerman. Robin Shepherd claims here very clearly that the psychology and personality of these persons is indifferent.
I don’t want to believe that you knowingly and intentionally distort and misinterpret the views of Robin Shepherd so I’m convinced that you are confusing it with an other book and with an other author.
October 7, 2009 at 6:40 am
amie
Thanks peterthehungarian. Of course Lerman’s requirement that one not mention at all a phenomenon which exists because the mere mention implies endorsement is ridiculous and would render Shepherd’s analysis incomplete and ahistorical, as PetraMb also pointed out.
October 7, 2009 at 10:40 am
The anti discriminator
peterthehungarian
.
## But here I know that my criticism of your extremely stupid bullshit won’t be deleted (##
.
I never want stuff to be deleted …I call it out to identify it as (normally )Islamophobic or trying to insinuate critics of Israel or the UK /US murderous Iraq/ Afgh venture are haters or anti Semitic without the vaguest reason….but if it were deleted my point would be lost.
Congratulations to CIFwatch for pointing out some areas of discrimination!
TAD
October 7, 2009 at 1:00 pm
Cittothechase
AKUS, a number of Jewish posters closed their accounts with CIF because fellow Jews, like you, were being treated with obvious distain and discrimination. For you now to thank Berchmans, a well known censorious little twerp with self confessed cosy relations with CIF is enough to make those same Jews, including me, nauseous. For you to mention that you intend to use Berchmans post on this site to try and get yourself reinstated at CIF is beyond gut wrenching and a slap in the collective faces of Jews like myself who genuinely supported you and others, who have been banned or pre moderated simply for being pro Israel Jewish posters. I believe those of us who closed our CIF accounts displayed more integrity than you are showing here.
It is some relief to us at least that CIF is flagging for want of more substantive posters than the coterie they now depend upon, but then we are pro Israel Jews with little interest in our own egos. We certainly do not have any interest in helping to revive those threads which are now plainly on their last legs, and reduced to Berchmans and other simpletons’ slogan-type rhetoric.
SilverTrees and Louise, I take my hat of to both of you. Don’t let the buggers divide and conquer, here. You know who they are.
October 7, 2009 at 1:07 pm
MischaG
To Akus – I just want to support what Cittothechase has said -basically he/she beat me to it. Begging CiF to reinstate you is acting like a House Jew, particularly when other Jews publicly cut their ties after writing to Georgina Henry to tell her to remove their registration details.
We know who these Jews are, because their archives haven’t been removed, as yours was when you were banned – all it says is that the page can’t be shown.
Well said, Cittothechase, Louise and Silvertrees.
October 7, 2009 at 7:55 pm
AKUS
Dear Citto and Mischa – sometimes I guess people don’t know when I’m serious. Don’t worry yourselves about it.
October 7, 2009 at 8:41 pm
AKUS
I’ve been keeping track of events on the “Troublesome Sheikh” thread, contributed by one of Ilan Pappe’s students or colleagues at Exeter, the incongrously named Dumper, which has led to more crap being dumped on his thread than I can ever recall.
The clean-up squad has been busy removing comments, and “disappearing” several.
sydk’s perfectly reasonable objection to the column – after several hours and about 20 -30 recommendations – gone!
Well, he’ll be joining the rest on the bright side (here) pretty soon at that rate.
When I looked at about 4:30 pm US time, there were, I think, 88 comments – now there are 82.
Poof – 6 comments vanished into the ether.
The amount of sheer ignorance and rubbish posted by the Israel bashers on that thread has reached a new high (or low).
(I just hope this time I get the blockquote thing right!!)
Inability to distibguish between Al Aksa and the Dome of the Rock by someone who has never been to jerusalem but knows all about it:
a claim that Al Aksa had been destroyed by Jews,
a claim that it was NOT destroyed because of the sheikh’s defence of the mosque,
a claim showing how Israel destroys the holy places of other religions by claiming the temple was built after the conquest of the Canaanites -(I’m not making this up!!):
Claims that Israel had denied the sheikh a Nobel prize to avoid recognition of islamic scientific advances (Gareth100 again):
The usual veiled threat of further Moslem violence:
a claim that Israel created the failed Palestinian state by a resident Israeli Communist:
a claim that Israel should have added 850,000 North African Jewish men, women, and children to its armed forces in the 1950′s:
and for the cherry on the cake just as the thread closed (probably the moderators couldn’t get off the floor for laughing), talknic shows up:
pokingpinocchio
07 Oct 09, 7:26pm (about 6 hours ago)
!
October 7, 2009 at 11:54 pm
The anti discriminator
MischaG
## acting like a House Jew, ##
.
You are typifying what Jews should be like or how they should feel. Is this not yet another kind of anti Semitism which this blog is meant to fight against?
No to anti Semitism on CIFwatch!
B
October 8, 2009 at 12:05 am
The anti discriminator
Cittothechase
.
##Jews.. who have been banned or pre moderated simply for being pro Israel Jewish posters.##
.
This is f***ing rubbish ..and as much poor meism as a body can take. You were unable to post following the rules ..you will have used insulting language or repeated some fatuous deleted accusation..in short you were not subtle. Your lack of wit ..not anti Semitism caused your banning
AKUS on the other hand was funny and interesting but was hounded as the only Zionist left standing and over reacted ( I guess) . As I said earlier the ones left are the retreads.. so easy to spot with their CIF-related names ..fury at CIF and lack of any redeeming wit . Since AKUS left there is no humour whatsoever.. just the bitter Peter and earnest, toiling Petra.
TAD
October 8, 2009 at 8:22 am
SilverTrees
Anti-discriminator (and that’s a misnomer if ever there was one from someone who doesn’t blame Hamas for hating Jews – note that this intellectual pygmy doesn’t distinguish between “Jew” and “Israeli”)
You are not on CiF now. Mind your language – these are decent people and don’t try to pull this blog down to CiF’s level.
Moderators here –
Do we really have to endure this drivel from a member of CiF’s protected but sadly not particularly endangered species? He really is lowering the tone of the place!
But he IS providing you with more hits, isn’t he, and while he posts here he cannot post his inanities on CiF and up their ratings…
October 8, 2009 at 8:41 am
Mita
Silvertrees don’t pander to his nonsense. Call him Berchmans: we know very well who he is. I think that our being able to talk to him here without being conscious of being moderated is a degree of freedom owed to us.
Notice that he sets himself up to justify the deletion policy of CIF (though he questioned the banning policy).
Perhaps he will explain to us the justification for certain people being allowed to insult others (like Larrit) while most are deleted for such behaviour.
Perhaps he will explain to us why ATL writers are allowed to mention subjects forbidden to the rest of us.
Perhaps he will explain why certain threads have mods shrilly insisting that we stick to the subject while in others we are allowed to talk about the kind of bs he peddles so cheaply.
He can go and ask Henry and come back with her answers if she is too pusillanimous to do so herself.
October 8, 2009 at 8:45 am
Cittothechase
AKUS, sorry I misunderstood, you were merely humouring the CIF-Toadie known as Berchmans.
Just to clarify, Jews have started to de-register from CiF. They were not banned posters, merely posters who felt strongly that CIF allowed the vile to continue whilst decent Jewish posters were being banned on the most spurious of grounds. Along the way, there were many Jews banned or pre-moderated for next to naught, on occasion, without any justification whatsoever. We know of Jews who asked for explanation and never received any. CIF couldn’t provide an explanation. Look at their I/P threads now. It’s like watching a psychiatric unit that’s run out of medication.
As for Berchmans, is he still giving Ann Frank a blast when he’s pissed. What wonderful wit, It’s obvious why he’s never been banned, he’s amusing Georgina Henry no end.
SilverTrees is as ever on the ball.
October 8, 2009 at 2:20 pm
SilverTrees
Mita, let’s face it “His Master’s Voice” probably hasn’t the concentration span to take on board what he’s told by his masters at CiF let alone to convey it to us.
I can’t remember reading anything from him on CiF which remotely resembled an original thought or a constructive argument. They must be getting something for allowing him to remain although I can’t even begin to imagine what. Perhaps he’s their resident charity case or token something or other.
People, we are wasting too much time on this wretch. Let him sloganeer and get hits to this blog, but let’s ignore him from now on.
CittotheChase, I de-registered from CiF recently but they refused to remove my posts from the archives.
“It’s like watching a psychiatric unit that’s run out of medication.” I wouldn’t insult the psychiatric patients, who probably don’t know what is going on.
Guardianistas are not clinically insane, which makes their hate-filled rubbish inexcusable.